Elf Balance Patch Info!

[Mixture]

HAHAHA!

This is "EGO" talking now.

Your first post:
"Damage: The self-buffed damage of Templars increased slightly but their attack speed became slightly (s)lower" the word slightly is an understatement, from 30% -> 12% att speed is not slightly in my opinion.

I appreciate your efforts to increase self-buffed dmg output because it was ridiculously low. But i noticed you have also reduced the effectiveness of regular attacks by reducing the Att Speed considerably. Why? I understand your reasons for nerf-ing blunt dmg by 10% (at lvl 7) since you buffed stats but please justify why you reduced the Att Speed by that much percentage. I am not asking for change, just justification so i understand. Thank you.

25 milliseconds decrease in attack delay fits the definition of the word "SLIGHTLY". Come on man! You can comprehend this. Lets be honest here. You have a subjective sense of of how attackspeed works but I have the numbers to show. If the difference is above 100 ms then we can have a REAL argument here.

PS: You're already answered by White Arctic Fox. Don't worry my friend, since the blunt mastery was not change from "CONVERSION" to "INT-BASED" (lucky for RBF templars), a new era of templar fest lurks in the future. The SLIGHT decrease in attackspeed is actually a futile effort to prevent that. I think one of the reason why blunt mastery was not change to int base is to prevent templar fanboys (does that include you?) from quitting. RBF doesn't want their cash cows quit.

Yes i also believe this is the reason. However, from a personal standpoint you think that 25 milliseconds is negligible. That is YOUR preference from a standpoint of numbers with no practical consideration, i have played templar long enough to know that 18% drop in att speed is significant from 30%. Templars are 18% slower at lvl 7 blunt when compared to previous 30%. FULL STOP. now they are only 12% faster at lvl 7. there is no maths involved just percentage according to the skill.

Which reminds me, let me see how you came up with your numbers. 25ms sounds VERY doggy. 18% slower is 25ms? SHOW ME YOUR CALCULATION hahahaha

[yinggamer]

Yes i also believe this is the reason. However, from a personal standpoint you think that 25 milliseconds is negligible. That is YOUR preference from a standpoint of numbers with no practical consideration, i have played templar long enough to know that 18% drop in att speed is significant from 30%. Which reminds me, let me see how you came up with your numbers. 25ms sounds VERY doggy. 18% slower is 25ms? SHOW ME YOUR CALCULATION hahahaha

Now we're talking! We're in the end game now.

I already show the formula from other post but allow me to post it here.

The numbers you see in Character window is the attack delay. It is the number of milliseconds counted between every two attacks.

Attack Delay = D / (1 + Total Attack Speed)
Where: D = weapon base attack delay in milliseconds (bow is 1000, dagger is 700, club is 900 etc...)

Now I assume you're a well geared templar (that's where the ego comes from) so your total attack speed self buff is:
UPG club = 50%
Ash stone = 38%
Tenis = 30%
Guarder = 15%
Old blunt mastery = 30%, New blunt mastery = 12%

(old)Attack Speed Total = 163% = 1.63
(new)Attack Speed Total = 145% = 1.45

D = 900 for clubs

(old)Attack Delay = 900/(1 + 1.63) = 342
(new)Attack Delay = 900/(1 + 1.45) = 367

new - old = 367 - 342 = 25 milliseconds (HERE"S YOUR ANSWER)

[snipers334]

Now we're talking! We're in the end game now.

I already show the formula from other post but allow me to post it here.

The numbers you see in Character window is the attack delay. It is the number of milliseconds counted between every two attacks.

Attack Delay = D / (1 + Total Attack Speed)
Where: D = weapon base attack delay in milliseconds (bow is 1000, dagger is 700, club is 900 etc...)

Now I assume you're a well geared templar (that's where the ego comes from) so your total attack speed self buff is:
UPG club = 50%
Ash stone = 38%
Tenis = 30%
Guarder = 15%
Old blunt mastery = 30%, New blunt mastery = 12%

(old)Attack Speed Total = 163% = 1.63
(new)Attack Speed Total = 145% = 1.45

D = 900 for clubs

(old)Attack Delay = 900/(1 + 1.63) = 342
(new)Attack Delay = 900/(1 + 1.45) = 367

new - old = 367 - 342 = 25 milliseconds (HERE"S YOUR ANSWER)

you're a generous god you are

[yinggamer]

you're a generous god you are

Apologies for being redundant. This is where I stop.

[snipers334]

Apologies for being redundant. This is where I stop.

Not redundant, assuming you are petebebz you're the one who posted the forumla first! kudos!

I Always go that extra step XD I love doing this

[Mixture]

Now we're talking! We're in the end game now.

I already show the formula from other post but allow me to post it here.

The numbers you see in Character window is the attack delay. It is the number of milliseconds counted between every two attacks.

Attack Delay = D / (1 + Total Attack Speed)
Where: D = weapon base attack delay in milliseconds (bow is 1000, dagger is 700, club is 900 etc...)

Now I assume you're a well geared templar (that's where the ego comes from) so your total attack speed self buff is:
UPG club = 50%
Ash stone = 38%
Tenis = 30%
Guarder = 15%
Old blunt mastery = 30%, New blunt mastery = 12%

(old)Attack Speed Total = 163% = 1.63
(new)Attack Speed Total = 145% = 1.45

D = 900 for clubs

(old)Attack Delay = 900/(1 + 1.63) = 342
(new)Attack Delay = 900/(1 + 1.45) = 367

new - old = 367 - 342 = 25 milliseconds (HERE"S YOUR ANSWER)

"that's where the ego comes from " HAHAHAHA words of wisdom

Thank you for going into details on those numbers. Naturally i didn't expect you to factor in ash Stone or guarder because your calculation assumes the best possible outcome, but understandable because you based it off assuming my att speed setup. For the purpose of this example, lets say i am an average temp, with shield and no ash stones. Given the increase in att delay compared to your calculation above. Can we then conclude that the reason for the att speed patch is most likely aimed at top class temp (nicely geared, with decent exchange trans stats e.t.c) only? and a minor nerf for the average templar with an upg?

[yinggamer]

"that's where the ego comes from " HAHAHAHA words of wisdom

Thank you for going into details on those numbers. Naturally i didn't expect you to factor in ash Stone or guarder because your calculation assumes the best possible outcome, but understandable because you based it off assuming my att speed setup. For the purpose of this example, lets say i am an average temp, with shield and no ash stones. Given the increase in att delay compared to your calculation above. Can we then conclude that the reason for the att speed patch is most likely aimed at top class temp (nicely geared, with decent exchange trans stats e.t.c) only? and a minor nerf for the average templar with an upg?

Even if we remove ash att stone and guarder the difference is only 55 ms. Blink of an eye averages 300 ms and we barely notices it (of course we notice it now since we bring up the topic).

Now lets summarize so we have a proper closure here:
1. You complain (ok you're not complaining) that 30% to 12% is a "NOT SLIGHT NERF" but a "CONSIDERABLE AMOUNT" of change.
2. We show you numbers.
3. The numbers tell us that it is indeed a small amount.

So the conclusion we can make is blunt mastery's attack speed is still good. The decrease from 30% to 12% will not significantly affect Templar's overall performance.

You're ok my friend, you're ok. You perceive it to be significantly slower because that how brain works. The moment you read the "30% to 12%" your brain creates bias. Don't get me wrong, it's not your fault and it happens all the time. That's why science experiments needs numbers to create accurate conclusions. Now if you excuse me, it's Monday morning in our time zone. I have other "numbers" to work on.

I think we're done here.

[Mixture]

Even if we remove ash att stone and guarder the difference is only 55 ms. Blink of an eye averages 300 ms and we barely notices it (of course we notice it now since we bring up the topic).

Now lets summarize so we have a proper closure here:
1. You complain (ok you're not complaining) that 30% to 12% is a "NOT SLIGHT NERF" but a "CONSIDERABLE AMOUNT" of change.
2. We show you numbers.
3. The numbers tell us that it is indeed a small amount.

So the conclusion we can make is blunt mastery's attack speed is still good. The decrease from 30% to 12% will not significantly affect Templar's overall performance.

You're ok my friend, you're ok. You perceive it to be significantly slower because that how brain works. The moment you read the "30% to 12%" your brain creates bias. Don't get me wrong, it's not your fault and it happens all the time. That's why science experiments needs numbers to create accurate conclusions. Now if you excuse me, it's Monday morning in our time zone. I have other "numbers" to work on.

I think we're done here.

Its your choice to reply to this or not. and no i can definitely see a difference in att speed. therefore, my point still stands. Ill tell how and why. In comparison with other classes using very much similar gears with similar stats. we remove them for the purpose of looking at the extra speed gained or lost from a Templar. (for me a templar should be a little faster than few of the classes)


lets say the :
non-exclusive - (any stats that other char can have)
exclusive - ( stats exclusive to a class)

UPG Wep = 50% att speed (non-exclusive) - other class can have this speed
Ash stone = 38% (non-exclusive ) - other class can have this speed
Silva pet = 30% (non-exclusive ) - other class can have this speed
Guarder = 15% (non-exclusive ) - other class can have this speed
Old blunt mastery = 30%, New blunt mastery = 12% (EXCLUSIVE)

using your formula....

D = 900 for clubs
(old)Attack Delay = 900/(1 + 0.3) = 692
(new)Attack Delay = 900/(1 + 0.12) = 804

new - old = 804 - 692 = 112 milliseconds


For ANY well geared char assuming the non-exclusive items, the standard base speed without factoring the weapon base speed (V.Fast, Fast... etc) is therefore,

UPG Wep = 50%
Ash stone = 38%
Silva pet = 30%
Guarder = 15%

= 133% (in my opinion this should not be factored in when calculating Templar att speed delay), on the basis that Templar should be a little faster than other classes.
I hope you see the reason behind my mindset.

Of course when everybody does their calculations, they factor every non-exclusive att speed as if its only exclusive to the class. I am open to ears. WHY?

I notice the difference because its 112 ms not 25ms. naturally i always have those non-exclusive items and always benefit from them. 133% for me is a standard (so like 0% if you get what i mean), if you then add 30% and then remove 18% i WILL notice.

[yinggamer]

Its your choice to reply to this or not. and no i can definitely see a difference in att speed. therefore, my point still stands. Ill tell how and why. In comparison with other classes using very much similar gears with similar stats. we remove them for the purpose of looking at the extra speed gained or lost from a Templar. (for me a templar should be a little faster than few of the classes)


lets say the :
non-exclusive - (any stats that other char can have)
exclusive - ( stats exclusive to a class)

UPG Wep = 50% att speed (non-exclusive) - other class can have this speed
Ash stone = 38% (non-exclusive ) - other class can have this speed
Silva pet = 30% (non-exclusive ) - other class can have this speed
Guarder = 15% (non-exclusive ) - other class can have this speed
Old blunt mastery = 30%, New blunt mastery = 12% (EXCLUSIVE)

using your formula....

D = 900 for clubs
(old)Attack Delay = 900/(1 + 0.3) = 692
(new)Attack Delay = 900/(1 + 0.12) = 804

new - old = 804 - 692 = 112 milliseconds


For ANY well geared char assuming the non-exclusive items, the standard base speed without factoring the weapon base speed (V.Fast, Fast... etc) is therefore,

UPG Wep = 50%
Ash stone = 38%
Silva pet = 30%
Guarder = 15%

= 133% (in my opinion this should not be factored in when calculating Templar att speed delay), on the basis that Templar should be a little faster than other classes.
I hope you see the reason behind my mindset.

Of course when everybody does their calculations, they factor every non-exclusive att speed as if its only exclusive to the class. I am open to ears. WHY?

I notice the difference because its 112 ms not 25ms. naturally i always have those non-exclusive items and always benefit from them. 133% for me is a standard (so like 0% if you get what i mean), if you then add 30% and then remove 18% i WILL notice.

Just because that 133 percent is common to every class doesn't mean you have to cancel it or make it zero. Why? Because att delay is a rational function not a linear function.

But if you still insist then go ahead. At this point I don't really care. If you really notice a significant difference then I believe you. Congratulations! You're gifted with Dunning Kruger effect.

[snipers334]

your stupid picture is stupid lol and that exponential rise is also stupid, i mean look at it.

YES OMG LOOK AT IT WHAT THE FLOX IS THAT

this isnt mathematics its stupidity. ALL the points you made are irrelevant to the purpose of which i came here. You a funny kid ill give you that, but from your reply looks like you the one who cant handle simple facts about your points and baby maths.

even with all your point you fail to mention 10% nerf in blunt. not that i was complaining. but dont let me stop you..... carry on raging.
This is why ppl like you cant understand the difference between class effectiveness and common sense

I can easily address you without breaking a sweat. blunt dmg was never the main source of dmg for Templars so the decrease was never questioned. go on to calculate that 18% decrease in att speed is 25 milliseconds. I have been playing the game for almost a decade sometimes on and off. Lets say you are right, i can easily see the effects of your so called 25 millisecond delay with my eyes and my dmg effectiveness when i attack (its ALOT when it comes down to PvP) and that is without resulting calculations. Experience is everything! noobs like you cant understand.

you're retarded and very binary. Get lost! You say school school school everywhere, must mean that for you without school common sense dont exist? You are an idiot if you think school is the only source of knowledge. clearly even school didnt do anything positive to your non-existent IQ. like i say to every idiot who dont understand. Expand your horizon trololol

Bruh im pretty sure you don't believe in horizons coz the earth is flat.

i have played templar long enough to know that 18% drop in att speed is significant from 30%. Templars are 18% slower at lvl 7 blunt when compared to previous 30%. FULL STOP. now they are only 12% faster at lvl 7. there is no maths involved just percentage according to the skill.

Which reminds me, let me see how you came up with your numbers. 25ms sounds VERY doggy. 18% slower is 25ms? SHOW ME YOUR CALCULATION hahahaha

- no maths
- wants calculation
- fails to understand calculations
- rage

You've now seen: linear, exponential and asymptotes, I just hope you're keeping notes and prevent me from making more quotes so that I don't have to devote any more time to sink that ship you're in that to begin with, was never afloat.

You really didn't listen did you, i had to make more quotes. With every post you make, you dig that hole deeper, you're never ever going to climb out of it LOL

we remove them for the purpose of looking at the extra speed gained or lost from a Templar. (for me a templar should be a little faster than few of the classes)


lets say the :
non-exclusive - (any stats that other char can have)
exclusive - ( stats exclusive to a class)

UPG Wep = 50% att speed (non-exclusive) - other class can have this speed
Ash stone = 38% (non-exclusive ) - other class can have this speed
Silva pet = 30% (non-exclusive ) - other class can have this speed
Guarder = 15% (non-exclusive ) - other class can have this speed
Old blunt mastery = 30%, New blunt mastery = 12% (EXCLUSIVE)

D = 900 for clubs
(old)Attack Delay = 900/(1 + 0.3) = 692
(new)Attack Delay = 900/(1 + 0.12) = 804

new - old = 804 - 692 = 112 milliseconds


For ANY well geared char assuming the non-exclusive items, the standard base speed without factoring the weapon base speed (V.Fast, Fast... etc) is therefore,

UPG Wep = 50%
Ash stone = 38%
Silva pet = 30%
Guarder = 15%

133% (in my opinion this should not be factored in when calculating Templar att speed delay), on the basis that Templar should be a little faster than other classes.
I hope you see the reason behind my mindset.

Of course when everybody does their calculations, they factor every non-exclusive att speed as if its only exclusive to the class. I am open to ears. WHY? (because the formula is asymptotic you dense mfker *cries in desperation*)

I notice the difference because its 112 ms not 25ms. naturally i always have those non-exclusive items and always benefit from them. 133% for me is a standard (so like 0% if you get what i mean), if you then add 30% and then remove 18% i WILL notice.

Just because that 133 percent is common to every class doesn't mean you have to cancel it or make it zero. Why? Because att delay is a rational function not a linear function.
Congratulations! You're gifted with Dunning Kruger effect.