Atzigan can we have an official response on what safe refine levels are

So I have seen people blow up items at +6 and have even seen people saying items blow up as low as +3.

While my concern here is not the fact that I need to buy the 1.5$ pres stones. Its knowing when I need to start using them. As it stands it USED to be +9 on ran. Thats the server I played on. People from Jin had +5.

You didn't ever announce the official new safe +ing level for weapons or armors. Personally I dont care if after +1 its not safe to try without a pres stone... however I and many other players would enjoy a set in stone number. So we know when to use pres stones, and when when not to use pres stones. Ya know?

Hey StrOwnz,
The rates have never been announced before and will possibly not be officially announced as we are unable to do so.
Goes against our rules. However, there's a post somewhere where BananaBandit gets very close to pretty much how it's working at the moment.
There is a slight chance that the rates will receive a small increase to what they currently are, but we can't make constant changes on a weekly basis.
I will let you guys know once we plan on doing some changes.

I dont mean for de-leveling. I mean for I guess reinforcement. There was a safe level. I dont care for the success fail rates... I just wanna know what the safe levels are...

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Originally Posted by Atzigan

Hey StrOwnz,
The rates have never been announced before and will possibly not be officially announced as we are unable to do so.
Goes against our rules. However, there's a post somewhere where BananaBandit gets very close to pretty much how it's working at the moment.
There is a slight chance that the rates will receive a small increase to what they currently are, but we can't make constant changes on a weekly basis.
I will let you guys know once we plan on doing some changes.

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Also, We all know that you are able to know what the success and failure rates are. I have been to private servers of this game who have all announced that it IS possible to set rates for success and fail... You dont need to lie men.

Also, I feel the success rates are pretty good. I forged all my 4part weapons (4 of them so far) with less than 5 total fails on each. My mace from parts to ancient zero fails. I just wanna know if after +5 I need to use a pres stone or itll break, or after +9..... whats the safe limit...

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Originally Posted by StrOwnz

I dont mean for de-leveling. I mean for I guess reinforcement. There was a safe level. I dont care for the success fail rates... I just wanna know what the safe levels are...

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Yep, reinforcement pretty much took a slight strike, forging has remained untouched.
Private servers do advertise the rates most of the time, but official games never do.

That is true - PWYNKI has never advertised rates and I for one will never expect them to.

The thing about rates is that it is deals with probabilities. Sometimes you can have a 50% success rate coded in and still fail 8 times out of 10 simply because you are having a really unlucky day while the guy doing the same beside you is successful 8 out of 10 times. When you publish success rates (and I can assure everyone here that every pservers out there sees this) you get those guys having the unlucky day raging because they are not experiencing that advertised rate. Rages don't control your luck. If your luck is gonna be crappy, it will be crappy and no advertised rates will make it less crappy.

Mind my original post on the subject was also meant to alert PW staff to the level-based fluctuation of the reinforcement success factors (I hope they will have their techies examine that and adjust for some future maintenance pleeeease!). These really should be a nice linear decline.

I do believe forging rates now are really bad its like 70% of items i forged failed..... reinforcing rings rates are like Jin rates they really suck i failed all 5 deluxes last weekend and couldnt make +12. About +ing armors weapons they are safe just +5 there are ppl i know tried reinforce after +5 with out premium stone and they lost equipment. So : forge rates are bad as Jin before or slightly boosted , reinforce rates as jin before, and reinforce of armors the only thing is better then Jin but only if u get blessing event like last weekend so u can + to +14 but +15 like ran ppl used to get is that even possible now? if no event u can not go pass +9 usually.... So Atzigan are we getting at least forge events some day? reinforcement blessings on weekly basis?

I had the opposite experience with forging in Jainus.

I forged a total of 5 upgrade weapons (sword, dagger, zhen, axe, club) only failing once for each one going from base parts to ancient over since the merge - and not jut during the event.

I can't remember a time either here or in a pserver where my forging went so smoothly.

I think is is just a matter of the kind of luck you are having at the time you are doing your forging.

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Originally Posted by BananaBandit

That is true - PWYNKI has never advertised rates and I for one will never expect them to.

The thing about rates is that it is deals with probabilities. Sometimes you can have a 50% success rate coded in and still fail 8 times out of 10 simply because you are having a really unlucky day while the guy doing the same beside you is successful 8 out of 10 times. When you publish success rates (and I can assure everyone here that every pservers out there sees this) you get those guys having the unlucky day raging because they are not experiencing that advertised rate. Rages don't control your luck. If your luck is gonna be crappy, it will be crappy and no advertised rates will make it less crappy.

Mind my original post on the subject was also meant to alert PW staff to the level-based fluctuation of the reinforcement success factors (I hope they will have their techies examine that and adjust for some future maintenance pleeeease!). These really should be a nice linear decline.

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i know a bit how it does work, so I guess the rate has a "cap" from +5 to +6 like 50% chance to success, and then it goes up to something 90% back from +7 to +12 something like that (while slighty decreasing).


tbh just by editing the client we should know the actual rates imirite ? I think I still got some edit tools that i haven't deleted and if nothing changed i should be able to find where the numbers are hidden =D

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Originally Posted by BananaBandit

reinforcing you can to to +5 safely
from +5 to +6 there is a major drop in success rate. Many folks, including me have broken gear there
If you get to +6 the success rate rises HIGHER than for +5 and stays reasonable until +9 where it drops like a rock again when you try for +10.

Here are the base reinforce rate numbers extracted from the client we all download :

+1 = 950000
+2 = 855000
+3 = 769500
+4 = 692550
+5 = 554040
+6 = 271687
+7 = 641921
+8 = 538738
+9 = 466991
+10 = 127819
+11 = 524493
+12 = 409645

Those numbers are based on 1000000 = 100%. To understand the success rate look at the first 2 digits to get the close approximate percentage.

The ones I flagged in red are the danger levels. those are the ones htat have a >50% chance of failing. In fact trying to hit +10 has a base success rate of only 12.7819% but if you make it past that you get a 52.4493% chance to get +11.

Those are the base rates you get if there is no events or guild buffs going. Guild buffs and events will add a couple percent to each of these.
Servers can be started to add a small percentage to these as well to allow servers like Isen and Jainus to have different rates. But ion no case will the rates be worse than these.

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Um I think someone got close to the rates already. Even if from +0 - +5 feels like 100% and then drops from +5 - +6 its just luck bro. 4 items broken already from like 20.

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Originally Posted by carnettsc

tbh just by editing the client we should know the actual rates imirite ? I think I still got some edit tools that i haven't deleted and if nothing changed i should be able to find where the numbers are hidden =D

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You can look at them using updated tools, but not change (edit) them. If you try to edit them, the loader will wipe your changes since they don't match the server image.

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Originally Posted by RBNXD

Um I think someone got close to the rates already. Even if from +0 - +5 feels like 100% and then drops from +5 - +6 its just luck bro. 4 items broken already from like 20.

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The base rates are a bit of a roller coaster ride. Whether that is on purpose or a bug isn't for me to say.

It does feel like a roller coaster ride. xD

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Originally Posted by BananaBandit

You can look at them using updated tools, but not change (edit) them. If you try to edit them, the loader will wipe your changes since they don't match the server image.

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Technically you still can "trick" the client. But that's not the right place to discuss about it. I do believe some people understood how to do it and were tricking the client with a server proxy sending near 100% rates to +18 rings to the client.

client with edited rates -> server proxy sending edited rates (you match the image of the proxy) -> server. It's typically a MITM attack to tamper rates that was working. idk if this was fixed or not, though. Or if the GMs were even aware of that "program" that was reported. I know some people, back there were one year / one and half that had like 8 or 9 rings +18 on Jin while they were known to spend nothing in the game.

Yeah i've heard of this but you shouldn't be getting a free ban ticket just to get a +18 or some.
GMs will investigate you and you'll end up banned prob 4 ever. Better stick to the game rules. Dont risk it. ^^

Let get this straight guy this ain't no JIN or RAN server anymore it Call JAINUS SEVER so wake up people .......so it have new rate deal with it it a Game..... Dont like it dont enchant it.....there ur answer people Ran Nomore JIN nomore ....

Example RAN rate - JIN Rate = new rate :)

I think last week after blessing event finish I tried to go higher than +9 all 3 attempt failed. I did use premium at +5 because you know ran rate is gone. as I read others people comment it is in fact it will broke at +6 probably 50/50. even with the blessing event, I did broke 2 items out of 5 at +6. this game is base on luck. but this is a game there is no base on luck in a game more likely base on program. Q.Q

so yeah suck it up. for me I don't like it.

I am to lazy to read everything so sorry if someone answered already but here:

Rings/Craft Gear:

No safe reinforce level if you fail from even 0 to +1 it will break. Before on Ran the rates were good so +4 was basically 100%, at the moment Jainus does NOT have Ran rates so there is probably no safe + anymore.

Ancient/Ench Weaps or Armors:

These are safe from 0-5 even if you fail it won't break. After +5 however any fail will break the item unless you are using premium preservation stone.

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Originally Posted by Atzigan

Hey StrOwnz,
The rates have never been announced before and will possibly not be officially announced as we are unable to do so.
Goes against our rules. However, there's a post somewhere where BananaBandit gets very close to pretty much how it's working at the moment.
There is a slight chance that the rates will receive a small increase to what they currently are, but we can't make constant changes on a weekly basis.
I will let you guys know once we plan on doing some changes.

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oh yeah! And i also believe that refining an items is a luck!

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Originally Posted by iamcoffeelover

oh yeah! And i also believe that refining an items is a luck!

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It kinda is. I've refined a lot of stuff too (after all I had to get those upgrades I forged down to a usable level). Sometimes my luck was bad and I failed 4 out of 5 times and sometimes it was good where I didn't get a single fail out of 5 tries. Just load up on crones -- they are selling for 100rps for half a billion crones. You can afford a few failures :p

I reach +8 once without fail